The whole Jesus Thing

This is a question for you Christians.

...What's up with that? Creating a son, born into the world just to get tortured and killed in order to save humans from their sins? If god is really omnipotent, wasn't it unnecessary? If any action was needed in conjunction with saving us from our sins, why not a snap of the fingers? Or a clapper with a sin switch?... Clap on! Clap off!

I was under the impression that God and Jesus were the same entity.

Taking that into consideration, God sent himself down to Earth and killed himself just to break some rules that he created just to save everyone?

An omnipotent being has the power to not follow human logic, Vauxhall.

An omnipotent being has the power to not follow human logic, Vauxhall.

That's the easy way to look at it. Perhaps there's a tribunal in heaven that has certain rules and such that each God has to follow, and that was one of them... have fun to break your own rules?

This is a question for you Christians.

...What's up with that? Creating a son, born into the world just to get tortured and killed in order to save humans from their sins? If god is really omnipotent, wasn't it unnecessary? If any action was needed in conjunction with saving us from our sins, why not a snap of the fingers? Or a clapper with a sin switch?... Clap on! Clap off!

Martyrs are very persuasive.

Martyrs are very persuasive.

So it's a manipulation technique?

The answer to that question, regardless of subject, is yes.

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 09:40:57 AM

Martyrs are very persuasive.

So it's a manipulation technique?

A very incoherent and sado-masochistic one at that.

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 09:40:57 AM

Martyrs are very persuasive.

So it's a manipulation technique?

If you look at it that way.  A Christian would say it was a symbolic example.

http://letmegooglethatforyou.com/?q=why+did+jesus+have+to+die

Not a single one of those links gives me a straight answer.

I see shit like, "God is smarter than you so stop questioning him!"

If you look at it that way.  A Christian would say it was a symbolic example.

Christians think symbolism outweighs torture?

Christians think symbolism outweighs torture?

It's unsure which method they've employed the most out of the two.

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 12:01:05 PM

If you look at it that way.  A Christian would say it was a symbolic example.

Christians think symbolism outweighs torture?

God does.

Quote from: ﮎingulaЯiτy on November 24, 2008, 12:11:34 PM

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 12:01:05 PM

If you look at it that way.  A Christian would say it was a symbolic example.

Christians think symbolism outweighs torture?

God does.

Kow do you know what God thinks? And how are we supposed to know why God does what he does? He is a GOD. His understanding and reasons are beyond our own.

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 01:19:47 PM

Quote from: ﮎingulaЯiτy on November 24, 2008, 12:11:34 PM

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 12:01:05 PM

If you look at it that way.  A Christian would say it was a symbolic example.

Christians think symbolism outweighs torture?

God does.

Kow do you know what God thinks? And how are we supposed to know why God does what he does? He is a GOD. His understanding and reasons are beyond our own.

How do you know?

Quote from: Emir Parkreiner on November 24, 2008, 09:17:38 AM

http://letmegooglethatforyou.com/?q=why+did+jesus+have+to+die

Not a single one of those links gives me a straight answer.

http://www.carm.org/doctrine/Jesusdieforsins.htm

Second result.

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 01:19:47 PM

Quote from: ﮎingulaЯiτy on November 24, 2008, 12:11:34 PM

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 12:01:05 PM

If you look at it that way.  A Christian would say it was a symbolic example.

Christians think symbolism outweighs torture?

God does.

Kow do you know what God thinks? And how are we supposed to know why God does what he does? He is a GOD. His understanding and reasons are beyond our own.

I never said I knew what god thinks.  I know what Christians think.

Quote from: KingMan on November 24, 2008, 02:49:14 PM

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 01:19:47 PM

Quote from: ﮎingulaЯiτy on November 24, 2008, 12:11:34 PM

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 12:01:05 PM

If you look at it that way.  A Christian would say it was a symbolic example.

Christians think symbolism outweighs torture?

God does.

Kow do you know what God thinks? And how are we supposed to know why God does what he does? He is a GOD. His understanding and reasons are beyond our own.

I never said I knew what god thinks.  I know what Christians think.

Yes you did. Right there. I highlighted it for you in case you missed it or forgot about it.

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 02:52:56 PM

Quote from: KingMan on November 24, 2008, 02:49:14 PM

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 01:19:47 PM

Quote from: ﮎingulaЯiτy on November 24, 2008, 12:11:34 PM

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 12:01:05 PM

If you look at it that way.  A Christian would say it was a symbolic example.

Christians think symbolism outweighs torture?

God does.

Kow do you know what God thinks? And how are we supposed to know why God does what he does? He is a GOD. His understanding and reasons are beyond our own.

I never said I knew what god thinks.  I know what Christians think.

Yes you did. Right there. I highlighted it for you in case you missed it or forgot about it.

God does.  As in the Christians see Jesus' death as a means to symbolize the daily sacrifice they are to make for their faith.  From my point of view their god used a martyr to get a point across.  I think that god would be a bit of a sadist.  From deductive reasoning that god would think symbolism outweighed torture. 

As in the Christians see Jesus' death as a means to symbolize the daily sacrifice they are to make for their faith.

Uhh, Christians see Jesus' sacrifice as the ultimate act of forgivness, and to be deserving of that forgivness they have to be forgiving of others. Letting your buddies off isn't really sacrifice.

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 02:58:34 PM

As in the Christians see Jesus' death as a means to symbolize the daily sacrifice they are to make for their faith.

Uhh, Christians see Jesus' sacrifice as the ultimate act of forgivness, and to be deserving of that forgivness they have to be forgiving of others. Letting your buddies off isn't really sacrifice.

It is when you do so by giving up your own life...

Quote from: Emir Parkreiner on November 24, 2008, 03:07:58 PM

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 02:58:34 PM

As in the Christians see Jesus' death as a means to symbolize the daily sacrifice they are to make for their faith.

Uhh, Christians see Jesus' sacrifice as the ultimate act of forgivness, and to be deserving of that forgivness they have to be forgiving of others. Letting your buddies off isn't really sacrifice.

It is when you do so by giving up your own life...

It's impossible to give up your life on a day to day basis.

Still, your God is depicted as a psychotic megalomaniac with jealousy issues, who would create a universe governed by rather loose rules, and then punish it when it acts accordingly.

Quote from: T.T. Monsieur on November 24, 2008, 03:09:13 PM

Quote from: Emir Parkreiner on November 24, 2008, 03:07:58 PM

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 02:58:34 PM

As in the Christians see Jesus' death as a means to symbolize the daily sacrifice they are to make for their faith.

Uhh, Christians see Jesus' sacrifice as the ultimate act of forgivness, and to be deserving of that forgivness they have to be forgiving of others. Letting your buddies off isn't really sacrifice.

It is when you do so by giving up your own life...

It's impossible to give up your life on a day to day basis.

God can do anything, heathen.

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 02:58:34 PM

As in the Christians see Jesus' death as a means to symbolize the daily sacrifice they are to make for their faith.

Uhh, Christians see Jesus' sacrifice as the ultimate act of forgivness, and to be deserving of that forgivness they have to be forgiving of others. Letting your buddies off isn't really sacrifice.

No.  The ultimate act of forgiveness was when he said he forgave them for killing him.  His sacrifice was giving up his life for his faith.  Hence, the symbolism.

Letting your buddies off has nothing to do with what I was talking about.

The New Testament makes no sense.  At all.  It is a testament to humanity's ability to ignore things that don't make sense as long as they comfort us and make us feel good that Christianity ever even got off the ground.  God must really hate intelligent people, and yet our intelligence is supposedly his gift to us.  What a bastard.  

Quote from: KingMan on November 24, 2008, 02:54:35 PM

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 02:52:56 PM

Quote from: KingMan on November 24, 2008, 02:49:14 PM

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 01:19:47 PM

Quote from: ﮎingulaЯiτy on November 24, 2008, 12:11:34 PM

Quote from: Moonlit on November 24, 2008, 12:01:05 PM

If you look at it that way.  A Christian would say it was a symbolic example.

Christians think symbolism outweighs torture?

God does.

Kow do you know what God thinks? And how are we supposed to know why God does what he does? He is a GOD. His understanding and reasons are beyond our own.

I never said I knew what god thinks.  I know what Christians think.

Yes you did. Right there. I highlighted it for you in case you missed it or forgot about it.

God does.  As in the Christians see Jesus' death as a means to symbolize the daily sacrifice they are to make for their faith.  From my point of view their god used a martyr to get a point across.  I think that god would be a bit of a sadist.  From deductive reasoning that god would think symbolism outweighed torture. 

Um, I AM a christian, and I don't believe that. Are you going to tell me what a Christian believes, even though I have been one all my life and you undoubtedly have much less knowledge of it? We believe that when Jesus died, he bore the burden of all sins from past and present. And it is because he did, we are all forgiven by God merely by asking for it. He gave us the ultimate gift, salvation. That is what we believe.

That is what You believe, not christians in general.

That is what You believe, not christians in general.

You are being stupid. I believe what every other christian believes. we have the same beliefs. And do you know what Christians believe?

Still, your God is depicted as a psychotic megalomaniac with jealousy issues, who would create a universe governed by rather loose rules, and then punish it when it acts accordingly.

By whom?

Letting your buddies off has nothing to do with what I was talking about.

So then why did you say Christians compare their daily lives with Jesus' sacrifice? That's blasphemous.

The New Testament makes no sense.  At all.

Interesting opinion.

Um, I AM a christian

You ARE a troll.