How do FEers explain the horizon?

One I heard is that the flat earth is being pushed upwards to create "gravitation" and light is unaffected by this upwards movement so the line of what we see hits the ground a certain distance away.

Quote from: CommonCents on March 28, 2007, 03:51:38 PM

One I heard is that the flat earth is being pushed upwards to create "gravitation" and light is unaffected by this upwards movement so the line of what we see hits the ground a certain distance away.

What?  Who said that?

Quote from: CommonCents on March 28, 2007, 03:51:38 PM

One I heard is that the flat earth is being pushed upwards to create "gravitation" and light is unaffected by this upwards movement so the line of what we see hits the ground a certain distance away.

What?  Who said that?

Isn't the Flat Earth Society really just promoting that kind of ultimately baseless leap of faith?  In other words, what reason do I really have to take your word over the word of everybody I believe in and trust, and turn my back on everything I've believed for as long as I can remember?

Even though you couch your theories in scientific terms, I don't think it's truly scientific, because it's all tailored to fit your view of the world; it's entirely subjective, rather than objective which all science must be to be valid; you just come up with plausible theories to explain away the deep, deep flaws in Flat Earth Theory.  Show me some kind of real evidence that I can observe, because I have TONS of that suggesting that the earth is round... I think this whole world-view is entirely faith-based.

So I can basically sum up your rejection of my theory with a, "nu uh!"
You are a true scientist 
I stand by my theory.

Actually, to take it further (and I do hope you reply), when a boat is going over the horizon the mast and the sail should both be the same distance away from me observing it.  Yet, we see the mast disappear first.  Why is THAT?

This is observable evidence that the surface of the earth is curved.  I want the same demonstrating that the earth is flat.

About that "Look down at the ground" argument... haven't you ever noticed that the bigger a circle is, the less pronounced the curve?  It quite validly explains why the surface of the earth appears flat even though it is curved.  Even according to FE theory, the earth is huge!

But narcberry, this forum is supposed to be for "Flat Earth Debate & Discussion".  I have yet to see something on these boards explaining the mast disappearing before the sail before going over the horizon.  This is a big part of my own belief that the earth is round, because it's something that was pointed out to me very early in my life when I was on the beach and could actually see the effect.

Like I said, there's plenty of real evidence that the earth is round.  You can't just invoke "theory" in the absence of evidence, if your theory actually goes against the evidence.  If there is nothing observable to suggest that the earth is flat (other than that statement "Look outside your window" or "Look down at the ground", neither of which sounds very convincing to me), why does this theory even exist?

About that "Look down at the ground" argument... haven't you ever noticed that the bigger a circle is, the less pronounced the curve?  It quite validly explains why the surface of the earth appears flat even though it is curved.  Even according to FE theory, the earth is huge!

I'm through wasting my time with you, too, narcberry.  This forum is supposed to exist for believers and skeptics to have an honest discourse, but you don't seem particularly interested in that.  Sometimes getting your point across takes more than just a few statements.  Maybe someday you'll grow up and realize that.  I'm going to try to seek out the more intelligent among your group (like Mr. Bishop) for real answers.

Blind rejection.  Ha.  What about your blind rejection of a round earth?

You can't just invoke "theory" in the absence of evidence, if your theory actually goes against the evidence.

Let me give a simple explanation to the horizon.

First, it is important to understand that light is affected by the upwards accelaration of earth. This makes the light that comes from longer distances show more effects of gravity. The horizon is a direct effect of this. If light comes directly from in front of you, it acts as a point of comparison. That is our normal light effect. However, to the right and to the left of you are sources of light that have traveled further. This is since they come from an angle and are therefore traveling along a more distant path. This makes the effect of gravity more severe. This effect gets more and more amplified the more you look to your right and left. Hence, the horizon effect.

So you ask, "The gravitational affect would be just the opposite of what you describe, why doesnt the 'horizon effect' create a horizon that is concave instead of convex?"
Well you are quite right to observe this. This is however countered by the fact that our eyes actually observe things to be upside down, our brains counter this. This is why the horizon appears to be just the opposite of what you would expect.

So you ask, "The gravitational affect would be just the opposite of what you describe, why doesnt the 'horizon effect' create a horizon that is concave instead of convex?"
Well you are quite right to observe this. This is however countered by the fact that our eyes actually observe things to be upside down, our brains counter this. This is why the horizon appears to be just the opposite of what you would expect.

Quote from: narcberry on April 02, 2007, 04:36:34 PM

So you ask, "The gravitational affect would be just the opposite of what you describe, why doesnt the 'horizon effect' create a horizon that is concave instead of convex?"
Well you are quite right to observe this. This is however countered by the fact that our eyes actually observe things to be upside down, our brains counter this. This is why the horizon appears to be just the opposite of what you would expect.

That would not happen, the brain only flips the image, that would not change the appearance of the horizon. Also I wasn't aware waves had discernible mass, and so any effect of gravity would take a far greater distance to produce the effects you described.

Quote from: Unconvinced Richard on April 02, 2007, 04:42:57 PM

Quote from: narcberry on April 02, 2007, 04:36:34 PM

So you ask, "The gravitational affect would be just the opposite of what you describe, why doesnt the 'horizon effect' create a horizon that is concave instead of convex?"
Well you are quite right to observe this. This is however countered by the fact that our eyes actually observe things to be upside down, our brains counter this. This is why the horizon appears to be just the opposite of what you would expect.

That would not happen, the brain only flips the image, that would not change the appearance of the horizon. Also I wasn't aware waves had discernible mass, and so any effect of gravity would take a far greater distance to produce the effects you described.

Off topic
Wave theory is confusing to many people, including myself at times. Take light for instance. When talking about color, light is referenced as a wave that has no mass. When talking about particle theory, light is referenced as a photon that has mass. That is what confuses me. However, light has been shown to be affected by gravity.

On topic
You are approaching this from a perspective of a round earth that would attract the light with a gravitational field between the two bodies. This is why you're confused. Of course a horizon doesn't make sense if the world is round. But if a world is flat, the earth accelerates through the lights path. This means the light isn't bending towards the earth. This is why a flat earth and a horizon make perfect sense.