Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.

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Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« on: June 15, 2006, 08:27:36 PM »
I'm not going to believe easily faked statistics, fuzzy math, and conjecture.

I have the evasive skills necessary to slip past whatever cloak-and-dagger organization that's guarding it. They cannot possibly guard such a huge monument all the way around. Do the math.

Purportedly, the circumfrence of the earth is 78,225 miles. At least, you claim it is.

Now let's say these are totally awesome superhumans. Since the wall is HUGE, probably 150 feet tall, you'd be able to see it for miles. And it'd be shiny in the sun. Which means, and this is just a guess, if you were nearly blind, you could see it for five miles or so. Now each human, a SINGLE human, can guard one mile. Of rough terrain. And he can take on a group of well-armed men and women and stop them from advancing.

So, since they need to stop an approach five miles before it occurs, the amount of people need to guard one section is 5x.

If x = 1, then 78225 * 5 = 391,125.

Now that's a HUGE force.

...and it still won't stop the advance. A full square mile patrolled by one man? You'd need, say, TEN men to just *consider* it barely patrolled.

So we're gonna need ten men for each square mile.

391,125 * 10 = 3,911,250.

And now we  have MILLIONS of guards and it's STILL unprotected.

And this is a very generous estimate. Factor in binoculars, and you're looking at protecting HUNDREDS of miles.

So, if this ice wall exists, it's *impossible* that we can't just push our way through and see it.

Show me something tangible and we'll talk more numbers. I want a picture of this ice wall. Thanks.

By the way, it's only ten miles thick? The ocean is about three miles deep.

The weight of the entire pacific ocean against ten miles of ice would shatter it instantly. Explain that, too.
I myself am not a RE'er or FE'er more a OE'er with lumpy bits (Oval Earther with lumpy bits)

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #1 on: June 15, 2006, 08:28:57 PM »
there going to show you pictures of antarctica. This is where there ice wall is, because antarctica goes all the way around the world.
 am the center of the universe

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2006, 08:33:27 PM »
But where's the huge vertical *wall*? I know where Antarctica is (or where you claim it isn't).
I myself am not a RE'er or FE'er more a OE'er with lumpy bits (Oval Earther with lumpy bits)

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #3 on: June 15, 2006, 08:49:36 PM »
That's the thing, there are huge walls in antarctica, but only for short lengths, definetly not the whole way around.
 am the center of the universe

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #4 on: June 15, 2006, 08:52:18 PM »
And where these walls aren't, what's to stop me from wandering straight off the edge of the earth?

Why do I see no pictures of ice walls?
I myself am not a RE'er or FE'er more a OE'er with lumpy bits (Oval Earther with lumpy bits)

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #5 on: June 15, 2006, 08:53:50 PM »
dark energy  :lol:  that goes for n e thing else they cant explain 2
 am the center of the universe

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #6 on: June 15, 2006, 08:58:44 PM »
Quote from: "Luke_smith64"
dark energy  :lol:  that goes for n e thing else they cant explain 2



*sigh*

I want to be proven wrong.

Show me evidence of this ice wall. In a measurable form, thanks.
I myself am not a RE'er or FE'er more a OE'er with lumpy bits (Oval Earther with lumpy bits)

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #7 on: June 15, 2006, 09:00:17 PM »
I will personally give you a pic of the icewall, even though i am an RE'er, gimme a few
 am the center of the universe

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #8 on: June 15, 2006, 09:03:10 PM »
Thank you.
I myself am not a RE'er or FE'er more a OE'er with lumpy bits (Oval Earther with lumpy bits)

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #9 on: June 15, 2006, 09:11:10 PM »
I'm back from antarctica bro, here ya go

 am the center of the universe

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #10 on: June 15, 2006, 09:16:56 PM »
Your proof is infallible and I am converted.

Thank you.
I myself am not a RE'er or FE'er more a OE'er with lumpy bits (Oval Earther with lumpy bits)

?

Doomie

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #11 on: June 15, 2006, 09:18:00 PM »
Your picture doesn't make sense. How do we see the other stars, then? Because if the earth is flat, and it moved upside down so we could see the other stars, we'd all fall off!

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #12 on: June 15, 2006, 09:19:21 PM »
Quote from: "Doomie"
Your picture doesn't make sense. How do we see the other stars, then? Because if the earth is flat, and it moved upside down so we could see the other stars, we'd all fall off!


stars are above us dude
 am the center of the universe

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #13 on: June 15, 2006, 11:26:08 PM »
Stars are located in every direction.
y the power of truth, I, a living man, have conquered the universe.

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2006, 02:19:49 AM »
So you can show me statistics. You can show me numbers. You can show me a conspiracy.

But you cannot show me a huge 150 foot sheer ice wall?

Can you offer no physical proof? Math is nice. It's nicer when it's relevant to the real world.
I myself am not a RE'er or FE'er more a OE'er with lumpy bits (Oval Earther with lumpy bits)

?

Erasmus

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Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #15 on: June 16, 2006, 09:53:14 AM »
Mr. the Great, I am not impressed by your analysis.

Supposing for a moment that the government does guard it solely by posting men on it, these men are 150 in the air.  From that hight they can see at least 15 miles in every relevant direction (this of course is calculating using the RE model... on a FE they might see farther).  Thus you can cover the whole wall with just 78,225/30 = 2608 men.

You can decrease it further by giving them snowmobiles and having them ride between waypoints.  If they can ride 10 mph and still keep an eye on things, then in one hour one sixth the previous number -- or 652 men -- can cover the wall in an hour.  In fact, doing this gives them better coverage, since this way their 15-mile-radius field of vision doesn't have any holes.

Now take the terrain into account -- much of the Ice Wall is probably unapproachable except by air -- and you can trim down the numbers even further.

Strategically locate some helicopter pads (on the wall or floating) and you can have heavy armament on the scene in thirty minutes.  Assuming an Apache helicopter can fly 150 mph, in that time they could fly 75 miles, so we would need to place pads every 150 miles, requiring 521 pads.  Obviously, if you don't insist on thirty-minute response time, you can do with fewer.  Don't forget that the watchmen can see 15 miles away from the wall, so thirty minutes should be more than enough to intercept any boat that tries to approach, snap pictures, and sail to safety.

Of course, this is all assuming that the only means our governments have of detecting trespassers is by looking with their eyes.  We're neglecting radar and high-altitude spyplanes, probably with infrared cameras.

We're also neglecting intelligence.  Anybody who wants to travel to the ice wall has to leave from someplace, and these someplaces can be watched by agents as well.  There aren't too many good places to set on on such a journey from.  Then, such expeditions would also have to be planned, and agents could get words about them before they even start.  Once they've started, agents could monitor radio transmissions.  If they can discover tresspassers a thousand miles away instead of only fifteen, then maybe they don't need so big a force as you say.

Basically, your objection is a straw man at best.
Why did the chicken cross the Möbius strip?

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #16 on: June 16, 2006, 01:54:50 PM »
Can't even show me a picture of it?

There is no damn way that you can hide a structure so massive.

None.
I myself am not a RE'er or FE'er more a OE'er with lumpy bits (Oval Earther with lumpy bits)

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #17 on: June 16, 2006, 02:07:41 PM »
They have a large blanket over it.

Its impossible to see.
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"Against criticism a man can neither protest nor defend himself; he must act in spite of it, and then it will gradually yield to him." -Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #18 on: June 17, 2006, 11:20:28 AM »
Quote from: "Mephistopheles"
They have a large blanket over it.

Its impossible to see.


*shakes fist*

Those bastards.
I myself am not a RE'er or FE'er more a OE'er with lumpy bits (Oval Earther with lumpy bits)

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #19 on: June 17, 2006, 04:27:31 PM »
tbh there are enough sonar bouys in the sea to spot any ship that gets within 1000 km of it easy, and there are also enough radar sites that can do the same.


and you wouldn't need to send someone there to kill them,  just a cruise missile. the new range of destroyers can give you a firing solution on a tennis ball going at mach 5 afterall.

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #20 on: June 19, 2006, 06:29:41 AM »
Quote from: "DrQuak"
tbh there are enough sonar bouys in the sea to spot any ship that gets within 1000 km of it easy, and there are also enough radar sites that can do the same.


and you wouldn't need to send someone there to kill them,  just a cruise missile. the new range of destroyers can give you a firing solution on a tennis ball going at mach 5 afterall.


So, in all these lovely pictures of Antarctica laid out in front of me, where are the myriad of 20 foot wide craters full of shrapnel?

Wait, can you REALLY not provide me ANY tangible evidence of this huge wall of ice?
I myself am not a RE'er or FE'er more a OE'er with lumpy bits (Oval Earther with lumpy bits)

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #21 on: June 19, 2006, 08:00:13 AM »

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #22 on: June 19, 2006, 08:07:23 AM »
here is what it looked like millions of years ago

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #23 on: June 20, 2006, 11:21:37 PM »
Quote from: "geekcorerob"
here is what it looked like millions of years ago


Oh, I can see the guard facilities, too.
I myself am not a RE'er or FE'er more a OE'er with lumpy bits (Oval Earther with lumpy bits)

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TheEngineer

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Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #24 on: June 20, 2006, 11:24:38 PM »
Quote from: "Galileo the Great"

Wait, can you REALLY not provide me ANY tangible evidence of this huge wall of ice?

The oceans are still full of water.


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
        -- Bob Hudson

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Desu

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Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #25 on: June 20, 2006, 11:31:54 PM »

Discuss.
Quote from: sam712
It must suck living in Richmond.
Since June 2006.

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #26 on: June 20, 2006, 11:38:36 PM »
Quote from: "Erasmus"


You can decrease it further by giving them snowmobiles and having them ride between waypoints.  



Quote from: "Erasmus"

Strategically locate some helicopter pads (on the wall or floating) and you can have heavy armament on the scene in thirty minutes.  Assuming an Apache helicopter can fly 150 mph, in that time they could fly 75 miles, so we would need to place pads every 150 miles, requiring 521 pads.  Obviously, if you don't insist on thirty-minute response time, you can do with fewer.  Don't forget that the watchmen can see 15 miles away from the wall, so thirty minutes should be more than enough to intercept any boat that tries to approach, snap pictures, and sail to safety.

Of course, this is all assuming that the only means our governments have of detecting trespassers is by looking with their eyes.  We're neglecting radar and high-altitude spyplanes, probably with infrared cameras.


Considering this goes back to the romans and maybe even earlier, can you explain to me where romans got all this technology from and, if they actually had it, why is there no remain of this so technologically advanced society besides stone ruins?

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #27 on: June 21, 2006, 12:37:09 AM »
Quote from: "sto0fo0"

Considering this goes back to the romans and maybe even earlier, can you explain to me where romans got all this technology from and, if they actually had it, why is there no remain of this so technologically advanced society besides stone ruins?


Romans didn't have to worry about defending from modern technology, so they didn't have to use it.

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #28 on: June 21, 2006, 12:48:44 AM »
I prefer to think that if there is a huge "ice wall", in order to get to it you would have to travel across some large land mass. In this case, if you travel south you will hit Antarctica. But in order to get the the "edge" you have to walk across the harsh terrain of Antarctica first. This both explains why we have photographic evidence of Antarctica's existance and could also explain why no one has seen a huge ice wall because it could be too difficult to reach with todays technology (let alone this "government" trying to stop us).

Okay. I want pictures of this ice wall.
« Reply #29 on: June 21, 2006, 03:56:22 AM »
I could show you pictures of the ice wall, but you might see my buttocks:-

http://theflatearthsociety.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2837