Poll

If you are a homosexual, you are a

Sexual deviant
25 (52.1%)
Mutant
23 (47.9%)

Total Members Voted: 45

Homosexuality is either:

  • 391 Replies
  • 51999 Views
?

narcberry

  • 5570
  • Reason > RET
Homosexuality is either:
« on: July 31, 2007, 02:01:53 PM »
Homosexuality is either a choice, or forced on someone by their genetic encoding.

If it is a choice, than that person chooses to behave in a sexual manner that is not the norm. This is sexual deviance.

If it is not a choice, than that person's genes have mutated to create such a physical attraction. This is a mutant.

Or more simply: perverts or x-men.

?

Skeptical ATM

Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2007, 02:06:11 PM »
Its a lifestyle choice. It is not black and white, so doesn't fit either category, or any better catgory.

*

Masterchef

  • 3898
  • Rabble rabble rabble
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2007, 02:07:02 PM »
narcberry is an attention whore.

?

narcberry

  • 5570
  • Reason > RET
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2007, 02:07:42 PM »
Its a lifestyle choice. It is not black and white, so doesn't fit either category, or any better catgory.

So they choose to behave in a way that is not normal. Sounds like deviant to me.

?

sharkzf6

  • 130
  • Everything is number
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2007, 02:08:16 PM »
narcberry is an attention whore.
He's just bored cause no one is interested in talking flat earth theory...
"Perhaps there will be babblers who, although completely ignorant of mathematics, nevertheless take it upon themselves to pass judgement on mathematical questions..."
- Copernicus

?

sharkzf6

  • 130
  • Everything is number
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2007, 02:09:39 PM »
Its a lifestyle choice. It is not black and white, so doesn't fit either category, or any better catgory.

So they choose to behave in a way that is not normal. Sounds like deviant to me.
Hehehe...x-men or pervs...that's rich man...beautiful...  ;D
"Perhaps there will be babblers who, although completely ignorant of mathematics, nevertheless take it upon themselves to pass judgement on mathematical questions..."
- Copernicus

?

Skeptical ATM

Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2007, 02:09:58 PM »
Well change the phrase 'Sexual Deviant'. Sex isn't all that homosexuality is about.

*

Masterchef

  • 3898
  • Rabble rabble rabble
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2007, 02:11:12 PM »
So they choose to behave in a way that is not normal. Sounds like deviant to me.
Define normal.

?

narcberry

  • 5570
  • Reason > RET
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #8 on: July 31, 2007, 02:11:38 PM »
Well change the phrase 'Sexual Deviant'. Sex isn't all that homosexuality is about.

You take the homosex out and all you have are buddies. Put the homosex back in and now you got deviant. Seriously, what does (homosexuality - homosex) really equal?

?

sharkzf6

  • 130
  • Everything is number
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #9 on: July 31, 2007, 02:12:03 PM »
Well change the phrase 'Sexual Deviant'. Sex isn't all that homosexuality is about.
Uh-oh...you seem a little sensitive in this area. I thought he made a great point...   ???
"Perhaps there will be babblers who, although completely ignorant of mathematics, nevertheless take it upon themselves to pass judgement on mathematical questions..."
- Copernicus

?

narcberry

  • 5570
  • Reason > RET
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #10 on: July 31, 2007, 02:12:18 PM »
So they choose to behave in a way that is not normal. Sounds like deviant to me.
Define normal.
As in, the norm.

*

Masterchef

  • 3898
  • Rabble rabble rabble
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #11 on: July 31, 2007, 02:13:29 PM »
::)

?

narcberry

  • 5570
  • Reason > RET
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #12 on: July 31, 2007, 02:14:11 PM »
::)

Well with a sample larger than your living room, of course.

*

divito the truthist

  • The Elder Ones
  • 6903
  • Relativist, Existentialist, Nihilist
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2007, 02:21:04 PM »
Homosexuality is either a choice, or forced on someone by their genetic encoding.

If it is a choice, than that person chooses to behave in a sexual manner that is not the norm. This is sexual deviance.

If it is not a choice, than that person's genes have mutated to create such a physical attraction. This is a mutant.

You wouldn't have made this poll if you've read current research.
Our existentialist, relativist, nihilist, determinist, fascist, eugenicist moderator hath returned.
Quote from: Fortuna
objectively good

?

narcberry

  • 5570
  • Reason > RET
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #14 on: July 31, 2007, 02:21:40 PM »
Homosexuality is either a choice, or forced on someone by their genetic encoding.

If it is a choice, than that person chooses to behave in a sexual manner that is not the norm. This is sexual deviance.

If it is not a choice, than that person's genes have mutated to create such a physical attraction. This is a mutant.

You wouldn't have made this poll if you've read current research.

such as..?

*

Masterchef

  • 3898
  • Rabble rabble rabble
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #15 on: July 31, 2007, 02:23:15 PM »
Even if he did, he would disregard it because it contradicts his narrow world views, which apparently are "the norm".

?

narcberry

  • 5570
  • Reason > RET
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #16 on: July 31, 2007, 02:24:22 PM »
You'd have to be ignorant to claim homosexuality as the norm.

?

sharkzf6

  • 130
  • Everything is number
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #17 on: July 31, 2007, 02:29:05 PM »
Even if he did, he would disregard it because it contradicts his narrow world views, which apparently are "the norm".
What current research that doesn't have an agenda would clarify this issue? Please post a link or reference.
"Perhaps there will be babblers who, although completely ignorant of mathematics, nevertheless take it upon themselves to pass judgement on mathematical questions..."
- Copernicus

?

narcberry

  • 5570
  • Reason > RET
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #18 on: July 31, 2007, 02:29:58 PM »
Even if he did, he would disregard it because it contradicts his narrow world views, which apparently are "the norm".
What current research that doesn't have an agenda would clarify this issue? Please post a link or reference.

Or that emoticon that rolls its eyes. We basically lose if you do that.

*

divito the truthist

  • The Elder Ones
  • 6903
  • Relativist, Existentialist, Nihilist
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #19 on: July 31, 2007, 02:35:09 PM »
such as..?

I don't think they are available online. It was mainly stuff I was perusing at the library as well as in some magazines. Magazines such as Scientific American Mind put forth an interesting perspective, putting the idea on a continuum:

"According to the article’s author, Robert Epstein, a Harvard-trained Ph.D., sexual orientation is not a black or white matter; rather, he concludes that sexuality falls on a continuum with heterosexuality and homosexuality at opposite ends. People may be attracted to members of both sexes, but with varying degrees determined by both genetics and their environment. Epstein explains that genes determine where we start but society exerts tremendous pressure on the individual to conform. Because the majority of people are “straight,” most of us become heterosexual ... The article also discusses the possibility of an individual changing sexual orientation ... Epstein writes that changing orientation is possible for people whose sexuality lies toward the middle of the Sexual Orientation Continuum, but for most gay people such a switch would be very difficult if not impossible."


Then, there is one taking a look at possible biological indicators:

http://nymag.com/news/features/33520/
« Last Edit: July 31, 2007, 02:42:27 PM by divito »
Our existentialist, relativist, nihilist, determinist, fascist, eugenicist moderator hath returned.
Quote from: Fortuna
objectively good

?

narcberry

  • 5570
  • Reason > RET
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #20 on: July 31, 2007, 02:38:24 PM »
Thanks for posting actual information about what you are talking about, a true rarity around here.

I do not see how that changes things, unless you are trying to say it can be a combination of deviancy and mutation. I fail to see how it could be anything else.

?

sharkzf6

  • 130
  • Everything is number
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #21 on: July 31, 2007, 02:48:59 PM »
such as..?

I don't think they are available online. It was mainly stuff I was perusing at the library as well as in some magazines. Magazines such as Scientific American Mind put forth an interesting perspective, putting the idea on a continuum:

"According to the article’s author, Robert Epstein, a Harvard-trained Ph.D., sexual orientation is not a black or white matter; <snip>
http://drrobertepstein.com/
Uh-huh. *start sarcasm* No agenda here. *end sarcasm*    ???
"Perhaps there will be babblers who, although completely ignorant of mathematics, nevertheless take it upon themselves to pass judgement on mathematical questions..."
- Copernicus

*

divito the truthist

  • The Elder Ones
  • 6903
  • Relativist, Existentialist, Nihilist
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #22 on: July 31, 2007, 02:51:23 PM »
Thanks for posting actual information about what you are talking about, a true rarity around here.

I do not see how that changes things, unless you are trying to say it can be a combination of deviancy and mutation. I fail to see how it could be anything else.

Well, right now science is forced to include deviancy/environment with their analysis. Not committing to calling it a choice.

However, I am of the opinion that it's strictly biological, and no conscious choices are involved.

The main argument I can essentially put forth is that, no one chooses what they like.

When I watch a TV show, or read a book or do any type of activity, I don't choose whether or not I enjoy it. I can come up with reasons and try to quantify my feelings consciously, but at the end of the day, that's not a factually accurate justification for my interest and that goes for everybody. The same goes for my attraction to a female or any other subjective aspect, and the reason why I think it applies to sexual orientation.
Our existentialist, relativist, nihilist, determinist, fascist, eugenicist moderator hath returned.
Quote from: Fortuna
objectively good

*

divito the truthist

  • The Elder Ones
  • 6903
  • Relativist, Existentialist, Nihilist
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #23 on: July 31, 2007, 02:52:15 PM »
http://drrobertepstein.com/
Uh-huh. *start sarcasm* No agenda here. *end sarcasm*    ???

You'll have to reveal your point for the slow people like myself.
Our existentialist, relativist, nihilist, determinist, fascist, eugenicist moderator hath returned.
Quote from: Fortuna
objectively good

?

narcberry

  • 5570
  • Reason > RET
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #24 on: July 31, 2007, 02:54:02 PM »
@Divito, to me that seems like you fit into the "they are mutants" category. Please help me see otherwise if this is not your perspective.

?

sharkzf6

  • 130
  • Everything is number
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #25 on: July 31, 2007, 02:56:38 PM »
http://drrobertepstein.com/
Uh-huh. *start sarcasm* No agenda here. *end sarcasm*    ???

You'll have to reveal your point for the slow people like myself.
OK. The man has his own "commerce" web site. In todays politically correct world, it is incumbent for him to not offend anyone. So of course he is going to try to be non confrontational with such a sensitive subject. Ergo, he takes the "it's OK to be a homo" approach so he can sell his snake oil... 
"Perhaps there will be babblers who, although completely ignorant of mathematics, nevertheless take it upon themselves to pass judgement on mathematical questions..."
- Copernicus

*

divito the truthist

  • The Elder Ones
  • 6903
  • Relativist, Existentialist, Nihilist
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #26 on: July 31, 2007, 02:58:09 PM »
@Divito, to me that seems like you fit into the "they are mutants" category. Please help me see otherwise if this is not your perspective.

However, I am of the opinion that it's strictly biological, and no conscious choices are involved.

There would be genetic mutation, yes. But I wouldn't call them mutants, and biological includes behavior (subconscious) as well as genetics.

OK. The man has his own "commerce" web site. In todays politically correct world, it is incumbent for him to not offend anyone. So of course he is going to try to be non confrontational with such a sensitive subject. Ergo, he takes the "it's OK to be a homo" approach so he can sell his snake oil... 

And you're arguing that it's not OK to be homosexual? If not, then that point was useless.

Also, what I posted was a synopsis of an article he did for Scientific American Mind. There was no reference to his site from what I remember or anything else he supports or is selling.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2007, 03:00:09 PM by divito »
Our existentialist, relativist, nihilist, determinist, fascist, eugenicist moderator hath returned.
Quote from: Fortuna
objectively good

?

sharkzf6

  • 130
  • Everything is number
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #27 on: July 31, 2007, 03:00:46 PM »
ROFL, and you're arguing that it's not OK to be homosexual?
Where did I state this?
"Perhaps there will be babblers who, although completely ignorant of mathematics, nevertheless take it upon themselves to pass judgement on mathematical questions..."
- Copernicus

?

sharkzf6

  • 130
  • Everything is number
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #28 on: July 31, 2007, 03:03:45 PM »
And you're arguing that it's not OK to be homosexual? If not, then that point was useless.
I'll ask again, where did I state this. And add, I was looking for references without agendas. Now that you have edited your post
*Oops* I'll give you another chance to make your point.
"Perhaps there will be babblers who, although completely ignorant of mathematics, nevertheless take it upon themselves to pass judgement on mathematical questions..."
- Copernicus

?

narcberry

  • 5570
  • Reason > RET
Re: Homosexuality is either:
« Reply #29 on: July 31, 2007, 03:04:35 PM »
There would be genetic mutation, yes. But I wouldn't call them mutants, and biological includes behavior (subconscious) as well as genetics.

So mutations are caused by genes. But the subconscious.. couldn't you say that is either determined by some gene or allowed by some gene? If you were to strip me of my genes (settle down ladies), I couldn't have a subconscious, unless you allow for conscious choice.

So it still seems like someone chooses, or is determined by gene or set of genes.